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National Insurance
Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:06 am
by marky9074
Has anyone actually managed to resolve the NI issue and worked out what they should be paying whilst working for agencies offshore?
I dont think it is as simple as paying voluntary contributions, which is confirmed by my other thread...
viewtopic.php?t=117
I know that we should be paying NI on a 'trip by trip' basis...
Any ideas?
Mark
Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:29 am
by marky9074
Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 7:19 pm
by marky9074
As I understand it for class 1 you pay 11% of the salary up to a maximum of 645 a week, then 1% of the remainder thereof.
Based on my earlier post 'if' class 1 contributions need to be paid, we could be looking at 3-4k bills to pay a year....
Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:50 am
by marky9074
Just had this from the nice people at GeoMotive....
Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 12:29 pm
by marky9074
CA23 NI for mariners
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:10 pm
by marky9074
I have decided to use Meridan Taxation Services
http://www.meridian.uk.com/
Who will submit both your tax return and NI forms. On initial inspection they do not see any Class 1 liability at all........phew!
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:12 pm
by marky9074
With regards to this post:
viewtopic.php?t=117
From our experience most companies have separate companies for each country, i.e. Shell UK Ltd, Shell Singapore Ltd, etc. which although linked are not the same company. If you are unsure you can leave it blank but subsidiaries are not usually the same company
Basically this implies that even though say CGG have an office in the UK, they are not the same company, therefore there is no Class 1 liability.
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:31 am
by marky9074
Ok, I have appeared to have come a complete full circle...
After spending some quite considerable time proving that we are not liable for Class 1 National Insurance contributions, as on the whole our 'employer' does not have a base in the U.K. another spanner has been thrown in the works.
As mentioned before, a person that performs their duties on board a ship is defined as a 'seaman' for the purposes of tax, the same cannot be said for National Insurance. I have been categorically told that I am not a 'seaman' and that I would therefore be a 'non-resident', and have now got to supply information since 2000 to document my case...
The worst case scenario is having to pay Class 1's for the last year, which in fact is quite a painful thought to be honest....
Anybody else made any progress with this?
Mark
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 8:53 am
by marky9074
I am at the moment trying to put together as many IMO Crew Lists as I can find. Anybody in a similar position, I would suggest to start getting a copy when you are on board to 'prove' you are on the crew, and that your position on board the vessel is valid. Evidently, discharge books alone are not enough...
....either that or start calling yourself a 'hairdressor' or 'cattle handler' as they seem to be valid professions...
Mark
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:15 pm
by marky9074
They are still stating that I am not a mariner....
"A supernumerary - that is a person employed on board a ship in any other capacity, for example, a cattleman, shop assistance or hairdresser as long as:
the work is done for the ship, the crew or any passengers, cargo or mail carried by the
ship."
It appears there is a question regarding who we are 'employed by'. I pointed out that as far as I am concerned as a navigator I am working for the 'ship', and as a 'client' I am working for the 'cargo' or 'mail'.
I cannot believe how hard this is to give them money!
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 6:07 pm
by marky9074
Just received this:
From:
MeridianTaxation@aol.com <
MeridianTaxation@aol.com>
Date: Jan 15, 2007 5:43 PM
Subject: Personal for Mark Payne
To: Mark Payne
Dear Mark
I believe you are under the misapprehension that the Income and National Insurance for mariners is dealt with in the same way. If only it were that simple!
For income tax purposes you are considered a mariner. For National Insurance purposes you may not be!
As we have advised this is a fairly recent development and we are monitoring developments. However every case is assessed individually so what happens to one "mariner" may not necessarily be the same as for another as many things affect the outcome.
However, our understanding of the current situation is:
A person who is a hydrographic surveyor, ROV pilot etc; who does not actually work for:
1. the ship (ship's engineers, ship's navigator, but *NOT* the
navigator for an ROV (remote operated vehicle or other such thing
which is separate to the ship)),
2. crew (i.e the chef)
3. passengers (entertainers etc)
4. or cargo
he is not considered a mariner for NI purposes (again, please note the Mariner's NI office deal with this differently to the Mariner's tax where he is considered a mariner!)
If he is not a mariner but is working in the oil and mineral industry on the UK Continental shelf (UKCS) he is dealt with by a specialist NI department and will have a Class 1 NI liability. This affects anyone no matter what their nationality.
If he is not working in that industry, or is not on the UKCS, he will be referred to the centre for non-residents as his employers are foreign *NOT* because he is non-resident.
If his employers are based in the UK they should be deducting tax and NI at source so if he is a freelance consultant agency worker they will have removed the agency from the equation and be looking at the end contractor. Links from agency to sub-contractor to contractor could possibly bring up a query as to his actual employment status (if self employed he cannot claim the Seafarer's Allowance) but so far there does not appear to be any cross over of information to the tax office on this one although that is not to say it will not happen.
These are very recent developments and we have only had clients referred away from the Cardiff NI office in the last couple of months with the final decisions only made late Nov/Dec. Hence, any information given prior to this may be different.
I hope this answers your queries.
Tina Scudder
for Meridian Taxation Services Ltd
Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 6:00 am
by marky9074
OK, the latest....
I got fed up with Meridian and the NIC office, so I made my own enquiries and got through to a very nice lady who went away and looked at my file....
Basically she said that I had enough money in the funds for the year 2003-2004 (provided by previous employment at Thales) for the state pension, then she checked the year 2005-2006, and again I had paid enough funds for that year (provided by employment at Medway Ports) to cover the state pension. So the periods in between that I was freelance are covered by the contributions I made whilst I was employed
Now for the year 2006 - 2007 I have the option of paying voluntary contributions or waiting 18 months until they will send you a statement saying that your pension is low on funds.....then you pay it in one lump.
As far as she is concerned as long as I was not employed in the UK, and not working in the UK we are classed as Non-Residents, but appreciated that we could not apply to be Non-Residents as per the norm. I come away quite happy that eventually I would get sent a bill for what I owed! And it will not be that much as voluntary contributions are not that great anyway....
Hope that helps others out there...
Mark
Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 6:06 pm
by marky9074
And here is the letter she sent me....